Regarding Richard Maxwell and Sarah Bugge:
Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 10:38:06 -0600 (CST)
X-Sender: dmaxwel@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: nbaily <innob@gci.net>
From: "Donald Power Maxwell, Jr., M.D." <dmaxwel@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu>
Subject: Re: Maxwells
Cc: nathan, bob, max, jane
Nathan,Bob, Max, Jane,
Yes I do and I found the original submitter (Bob Bond..see below)who
now
states that Richard "may be older than what the father of
Nathanial should
be"...also a mention in the Maxwell gen bk by Houston re;
marriage of a
Richard Maxwell and Sarah Bugge...SEE BELOW!!!!
I do think this is still a possibility...now how to prove!!!
Is there a CONNECTION to the Richard Maxwell line of Illinois...the
much
discussed line of William Bailey Maxwell of LDS fame!!
Don Maxwell
########
Hi Don, Aaron, and Nathan -
Several weeks ago we were corresponding in relation to the
parents of
Nathaniel Maxwell, who married Esther Carson. I had mentioned
that my notes
showed Richard Maxwell and Sarah Bugge as the parents, but could
not produce
any solid source.
Tonight, in re-reading part of the Florence Houston book for
the 7-millionth
time, I found Richard & Sarah mentioned again. Nathaniel's
history starts on
page 499 and goes on several pages. But, on page 531, the WILL
of Nathaniel
Bugge of
ENGLAND (not Scotland) is listed. The will was proved 24 Apr1656
and it
does show Richard Maxwell as the husband of Sarah Bugge, and their
children
as:
Nathaniel, Samuel, Sarah and Rebecca.
So this is evidently where the data came from, HOWEVER, that
1656 date makes
it too early to be "our" Nathaniel who was not born
until 1741. Could be
the same clan, but several generations have to be squeezed in
there somehow!
Max (LTCMAX117)
PS- Enjoy your holiday tomorrow!
#######
Greetings,
I hope that you do not mind that I am e-mailing you. I
finally received your letter bwhich was first directed to my Jean
Marie address in Santa Rosa, CA. and then redirected to my Willow
Creel address in Bend, OR.
Actually, we seem to be moving in your direction as we
now reside at 6110 Casa de Vida NE; Albuquerque, NM 87111.
When I was flying out of Pensacola, in the late '50s I
dated a Jackie Villars from your fine city. I remember
that her parents belonged to the country club and we an
old and prominent family.
Down to business! I did not receive the "recent research
report" with
your letter dated 09 nov. 1998.
I have just now restarted my search into family roots,
but I am now confident that my Nathaniel Maxwell is not
the son of Richard Maxwell and Sarah Bugge. Several of
us speculate that they might be Nathaniel's grand parents or even
great grand parents.
You surely are not bothering me. I will share anything
I have or may acquire with you. I just have done no research in
3
years. I am again starting and will work with you in any way possible.
Let me know how you would perfer that I contact you.
Creers,
Bob
########
At 07:02 AM 11/20/1999 -0900, you wrote:
>> Can you tell me more about Richard Maxwell , f/o Nathanial
>>Maxwell...where did this name come from...
>>
>>I am VERY actively searching the early Maxwells of Pa...including
your ,
>>esp since they were in AP. prior to Va.
>>
>>Don Maxwell
######
>
>Don,
>
>Nice to hear from you again (we've corresponded on this exact
same topic at
>least once before about 1yr ago) but as far as I know, Richard
and Sarah
>and the brother relationship bet. Nathaniel and Henry are
still, at best,
>putative. I will have to consider it speculative until I see
your
>triumphant documentation announcement on Maxwell-L!
>8-)
>
>I notice on my web cards I only noted the "speculative"
nature of the
>relationships on Sarah and Henry, but meant to include Richard.
I'm going
>to correct that this morning and add a note. Thanks for pointing
it out. I
>just uploaded a big update and havn't gotten all the glitches
out.
>
>Unfortunately, besides the notes derived from your posts,
I only have the
>resource below listed as the source for the Richard theory.
Have you
>managed to find anything substantive? As I recall, your original
source was
>a mention in a newsletter of 1994. Do you have a copy of that?
>
>source #51=Maxwell History and Genealogy by Florence W. Houston,
Publ. 1916
>source #74=Donald Power Maxwell, Jr., M.D.
>
#######
>
Regarding Henry Maxwell:
7/24/99
Dear Donald,
Seems like the Maxwells and the Carsons were inseparable until the mid 1800's! Guess I hadn't realized that they had apparently immigrated together, too.
I've not been keeping up with Maxwell lately. Mind my asking
a few questions?
Have you determined which ship Nathaniel came over on? Has his
father been confirmed to have been Richard? Any change in the
Sarah Bugge story? Last I heard she had been determined to have
NOT been his mother.
Also, William Baily Maxwell keeps turning up...any idea who he is?
nb
########
>Nathan,
>No,... I was trying to find the children of:
>
>JOHN MAXWELL
>married
>MARY CARSON
>in Down, Downpatrick in 10 JAN 1727 (per IGI and Ancestry.
com)
>
>A professional researcher in ireland failed on 2 seperate
projects to ID and
>children....this is very probably the missing link re: MAXWELL-CARSON
>families in Pa...not only Nathanial Maxwell(who married esther
Carson 1770
>in Phil., Pa.) but also Henry Maxwell of York Co., Pa.(who
married Agnes
>Carson)!!!!!
>
>
>Don Maxwell
>
>
>######
>Hi Don,
>
>Have you proved the connection between the Chester Cty. Maxwells
and the
>Nathaniel line yet?
>
>nb
>Nathan Osborn Maxwell Baily
>http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~baily/
>####
>> MY Ensign Thomas Maxwell was recently approved by SAR
as a new line ...the
>>first since 1919..due to a lost file at DAR...
>>
>Don Maxwell
#######
Esther Carson (believed to be the daughter of Walter & Agnes Maxwell Carson), they were Quakers from Ireland and settled in Chester Co. Pa.
Their daughter, Agnes Carson, married to Henry Maxwell her first cousin. Some believe as I do, that Henry & Nanthaniel were brothers. (Don Power Maxwell)
Henry Maxwell, born in 1730 Scotland, left Scotland and went to Ireland, with his uncle & aunt, Walter & Agnes Carson (Quakers). They remained in Ireland about two years, they then sailed for America. And settled in Pennsylvania. An ancestor of Henry's stated that he was highly educated and came of a well-to-do family in Scotland. (This is quite possible about the education, Scotland had free education), and brought money with him to this country.
Henry was eleven or twelve when he left Ireland. By 1741 Walter Carson and family was already living in Lancaster Co. Pa. (Now York Co.) Henry Maxwell married his cousin, Agnes Carson, d/o Walter & Agnes Carson. Henry was a weaver by trade. It is said he had 7 sons, and no daughters. He fought in the Am. Rev. War as a private in the 5th. Regiment of the Pa. Line. He is listed on the tax rolls of 1783 as owning one horse and two horned cattle, for which he paid a tax of five shillings, seven pence; and in the 1790 census, under the name of Harry Maxwell. (Even in England today....Henry is called Harry, the son of Prince Charles of Wales, named Henry, is called Harry).
Henry died sometime before 19 Jan. 1792, when his estate was
administered.
If Henry/Harry Maxwell owned any land it has never been discovered.
His uncle Walter Carson acquired from the Commonwealth of Penn.
100 acres on Big Botton, near Conewago Creek, on the east side
of the Susquehanna. In 1743, 150 acres at Three Springs. In 1744
200 acres on Great Conewago, and later the same year, 200 acres
more, on Conewago Creek, from John Steel. Though Henry Maxwell
was raised in the Quaker (Friends) faith, he (as far as we know)
never became a Quaker.
Don Maxwell
#######
X-Message: #1
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 11:47:21 -0600
From: "Don Maxwell" <dmaxwelljr@hotmail.com>
To: MAXWELL-L@rootsweb.com
Subject: [MAXWELL-L] Henry b1730 and Nathanial Maxwell b1741 related?
Did Agnes CARSON have a younger sister named Esther CARSON (or was she a neice as some have proposed)??????
If anyone can prove or disprove this, please reply.
If they were sisters, then it helps prove our assumption that
these two CARSON sisters
were married to two MAXWELL brothers.
Recent DNA results indicate that Henry MAXWELL and Nathaniel
MAXWELL are very
closely related. Since their estimated birthdates are just eleven
years apart, they could
be brothers.
And since they both had wives named CARSON, it would indicate
that two brothers in
one family married two sisters in another family....a very common
practice in the 1700s
and 1800s.
What leads to this conclusion?
In the MAXWELL FAMILY DNA STUDY, a living male descendant from
each of the
above couples (Henry Maxwell m. Agnes Carson and Nathanial Maxwell
m. Esther Carson) provided DNA samples. These two Y-chromosome
samples matched
exactly for the first 12 markers (loci). An additional analysis
(refined "high resolution" test)was made and the two
samples also matched exactly on a 25-marker test.
FamilyTreeMakerDNA statistical studies show that these two donors
are certainly related
and that they share a common ancestor in the past seven (probability
50%) generations.
In other words, Henry and Nathaniel could be brothers and their
father (name unknown
through standard genealogical processes) could be the common ancestor.
This is new and exciting inofrmation as both of these lines
seem to be at and "brickwall" and have been thoroughly
researched and revisited many times over the years!
Both FTDNA and the Maxwell DNA Study have the policy of not releasing
the name
of DNA donors, however, the DNA scores can be released with a
coded donor number.
Please visit our website, and your comments on the above are invited.
http://hometown.aol.com/dnamaxwell/myhomepage/index.html
Additional info: As of this date we have not had a UNEXPECTED 25/25 match in the Maxwell DNA study...till now. We have had 25/25 matches in genealogically proven lines to verify the reliability of the lab and the results.
Don Maxwell
Donald Power Maxwell, Jr., M.D.
18700 Wolf Creek Dr
Edmond, Okla 73003
405-216-0219
MAXWELL DNA website:
http://hometown.aol.com/dnamaxwell/myhomepage/index.html
THOMAS MAXWELL (1738-1785 Pa) website:
http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=donmaxwell&id=I06187
#######
X-Message: #2
Date: Mon, 01 Jan 1996 01:31:25 -0500
From: "Josette L. Maxwell" <maxwelljl@earthlink.net>
To: MAXWELL-L@rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: [MAXWELL-L] Henry b1730 and Nathanial Maxwell b1741
related?
A common ancestor could be either on the mother's
or father's side. There could be two sisters who married
unrelated men. It would be impossible to establish
any kind of relationship between the men based on
them having married sisters.
It has been proven for quite some time (documents and
records) that the Esther Carson who married Nathaniel Maxwell
was the daughter of Patrick Carson of Chester Ct. PA.
There is nothing that establishes the date of Henry
Maxwell's birth! Or that he married his first cousin. I do now
know that Walter and Agness Carson arrived in the US by
1728 at least. I also can prove that Walter Carson was
related to Samuel Carson of Londongrove Chester Ct. PA
It is possible that Henry was related to Robert Maxwell to
whose
will he was a witness in, if I remember correctly, 1760s Lancaster
Ct. PA. A number of the children of Robert have the same names
as those of Henry.
The probability is 50 percent that they shared a common
last name unknown ancestor seven generations ago as a
basis for suggesting kinship of Nathaniel and Henry - stuff and
nonsense.
I thought it was agreed that you would not use the Maxwell email
list
for this DNA stuff other than to announce where your website can
be
found. And, by the way, seven generations doesn't equate before
1800.
1st b. 1730, married 1751
2nd b. 1752 married 1773
3rd b. 1774 married 1795
4th b. 1796 married 1817
5th b. 1818 married 1839
6th b. 1840 married 1862
7th b. 1863 married 1884
Elapsed time is 273 years 1730 to 2003; elapsed time earliest
possible illustrated above is 133 years, assuming marriage at
age 21 which is quite reasonable.
.
Whether Henry Maxwell had sibblings or not is something that
is extremely unlikely to be proven or disproven. There just aren't
records or documents. The best lead is to get Walter Carson back
to Ireland and establish his relationship with the Maxwell family
there, if any. Walter and Agness Carson did have four children
which have been documented plus a fifth highly likely.
Josette Maxwell
Boone NC
###########
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 17:03:33 -0500
From: "L. Dale Shrader" <ldale@lightbound.com>
To: MAXWELL-L@rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: [MAXWELL-L] Henry b1730 and Nathanial Maxwell b1741
related?
We may as well let the DNA boys have this site...
Like they have already told me to stay off of it!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So, I do!!!!
######
X-Message: #4
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 18:36:29 -0600
From: "maxhouse" <maxhouse@netzero.net>
To: MAXWELL-L@rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: [MAXWELL-L] Henry b1730 and Nathanial Maxwell b1741
related?
Thanks, Don this should be very helpful for those who believe
in new idea's.
Just remember before the internet how hard it was to do this type
research.
Who would of ever thought a computer could help research our family
lines.
My grandfather never believed men walked on the moon, go
figure.....................from the time of Adam to the early
1900's men
walked, sailed, rode an animal, now me are walking on the moon
waving the
flag. Any Maxwell's searching Rev. Thomas Maxwell and Mary Pemberton
with
data to share, please post your line and I'll get in touch
Larry Maxwell
#######
1/27/03
Don,
Thanks for posting "this DNA stuff," I find the 25/25 results very exciting, if not proof positive of the exact relationship between Henry and Nathaniel. I appreciate your occasional posts on this subject and am astonished others do not. Really, lighten up folks. This is the 21st century, after all.
Josette,
Thanks for the update on Esther Carson's "proven" father, would you care to share other substantive information on her and that Carson line? What documentation was used to establish Patrick as her father? Have you noted any progress in Nathaniel's parentage? I'd appreciate anything more you have on these lines and apologize if the info is now common knowledge, I've not been able to devote much time to gen activities.
Also, can you explain what you mean by, "... seven generations
doesn't equate before
1800."? I count 6 generations from me back to Nathaniel.
Thanks again to both of you for your fine work.
Nathan Osborn Maxwell Baily
http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~baily/
Nathaniel>>William>>Nathaniel Carson>>Albert>>Nathaniel
Chester>>Sara Maxwell>>me
##############
X-Message: #2
Date: Mon, 01 Jan 1996 00:40:00 -0500
From: "Josette L. Maxwell" <maxwelljl@earthlink.net>
To: MAXWELL-L@rootsweb.com
Subject: Re: [MAXWELL-L] Esther Carson, dau of Patrick, was Henry
b1730
and Nathanial Maxwell b1741 related?
The will of John White of East Nottingham written Feb 15, 1758
identifies
his daughter Jean and granddaughter Ester Carson, executor was
Patrick Carson ("son" - i.e., son in law). Patrick
Carson is on the
tax list 1765 Fallowfield Twp. There is a record in the county
clerk's
office that says the father of Esther Carson, wife of Nathaniel
Maxwell
was Patrick Carson (Abbington, Washington Ct. VA). Children
are
established. I've not done any recent research on Nathanial and
don't
know if anyone has discovered information or not. I don't even
know if
anyone has tried to establish Nathanial's presence in Chester
Ct. PA
through deeds/tax records etc.
One can go back seven generations in 133 years at a minimum
if
there is marriage at age 21. It can take much longer depending
on
the age of the father when the child was born. My great great
grandfather
is the great grandfather of my first cousin, for example, because
my
line was the oldest child to the oldest child. Unless you know
exactly the ages, then you can't assume it goes back 7 generations.
In science, it has always been and still is that a 50% probability
is worthless. In science, it has always been and still is that
you
cannot make blanket assumptions without evidence. You also
do not present conclusions based on a single sample.
In genealogy, we use records and documents to prove linage.
I really don't care whether people pursue the DNA studies or not.
I do object to the use of this forum when the Administrator has
spoken. I do object to people making outlandish claims of
relationships without any evidence and incomplete knowledge
of the evidence available.
Josette Maxwell
Boone NC
MAXWELL LINKS:
MAXWELL
Nathaniel Carson Maxwell
Albert Leander Maxwell
Nathaniel Chester Maxwell
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